History of Feminism

cinnabonbon

(860 posts)

28. Read them and

Sun Jan 19, 2014, 03:54 PM

Jan 2014

it's clear that saying "yes means yes" is a bit too simplistic for complicated situations like this. If we do start to talk about power hierarchies and such, then obviously yes can given after, for example coercion or under patriarchy, and it won't count as real consent. I will have to think a bit closer on this, to see what branch of feminism fits me best. I enjoyed how she broke it down with agency feminism, for example. "This yes means yes."

I think this quote was great:

The [sexist] assumption is that women can be unequal to men economically, socially, culturally, politically, and in religion, but the moment they have sexual interactions, they are free and equal. That’s the assumption – and I think it ought to be thought about, and in particular what consent then means… My view is that when there is force or substantially coercive circumstances between the parties, individual consent is beside the point.

Very very interesting stuff! I think I'll reread it and let it sink in. Thanks so much for sharing, Redq!

(and as a sidenote, I am surprised to see her calling ableism "disablism". I've grown used to seeing the other term more often than disablism, so now I don't know which one is the more acceptable one.)

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Highlight:

Hey "Radical" Feminists [View all] arely staircase Jan 2014 OP

Would you mind clarifying what you are asking forgiveness for? BainsBane Jan 2014 #1

being a smartass instead of trying to reach an understanding arely staircase Jan 2014 #2

I appreciate your apology BainsBane Jan 2014 #4

right wing and left wing opponents of pornography do indeed oppeose it for different reasons arely staircase Jan 2014 #6

Rec for "yes means yes" MadrasT Jan 2014 #3

thank you and yes the porn thing is complicated arely staircase Jan 2014 #5

I haven't seen anyone say that porn should be banned. cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #18

+1 nomorenomore08 Feb 2014 #37

Thanks for this. redqueen Jan 2014 #7

viva leticia arely staircase Jan 2014 #8

There's a pretty well defined meaning behind "rape culture." Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #9

no there really isnt arely staircase Jan 2014 #10

I'm not super into the whole "agree to disagree" theme on this subject. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #11

it is a concept upon which arely staircase Jan 2014 #12

You do a lot of academic level reading in feminist theory? Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #13

oh mother arely staircase Jan 2014 #14

No agreement at all? Really? redqueen Jan 2014 #15

That is true for virtually everything BainsBane Jan 2014 #16

Disagreement between people on the same side is ultimately healthy cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #17

re: "yes means yes" redqueen Jan 2014 #21

I don't recognize cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #23

Read them and cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #28

I'm so glad you enjoyed it! She really breaks it down well. redqueen Jan 2014 #29

She really did. I love it when people use theory to explain, like she did. cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #30

I live in the UK... radtransfem Feb 2014 #34

Thank you for the clarification, Lisa! cinnabonbon Feb 2014 #35

Aw, radtransfem Feb 2014 #36

And I think many on the left often uses pro-porn stances as a means of escaping sexual shame ismnotwasm Jan 2014 #19

But even at best, it's not enough. The "prop" that is. nomorenomore08 Feb 2014 #38

what we should preach is mzteris Jan 2014 #20

Some will compare porn to other jobs as if they're analogous, redqueen Jan 2014 #22

I was reading about this yesterday cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #24

There's a lot of denial going on, for self-described liberals and progressives to be defending this redqueen Jan 2014 #25

There is no limit (no bottom) to human cruelty. We are a sick, sick species. nomorenomore08 Feb 2014 #39

I don't want to derail your post in the men's group noamnety Jan 2014 #26

Ugh, is that going on in that group? redqueen Jan 2014 #27

I'm at a loss for an appropriate answer. noamnety Jan 2014 #31

If it's a sincere attempt at honest discussion, the guilt by association bullshit needs to stop. redqueen Jan 2014 #32

I really respect and mzteris Jan 2014 #33