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onenote

(44,921 posts)

55. The OP's flawed reasoning

Sun Jan 26, 2025, 10:52 PM

Jan 26

The OP assumes that if the courts find that birthright citizenship doesn't apply in all cases, that means it will have the backward looking result the OP hypothesizes.

But that assumes that a court finding an exception to birthright citizenship wouldn't craft that exception not to have the result the OP hypothesizes.

It's not an all or nothing proposition -- nothing stop the court from defining the exception not to look backwards.
Put another way -- does anyone actually believe the court would issue a decision that meant they weren't citizens? And does anyone think the court wouldn't find a way to limit its decision?

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Ending birthright citizenship would make almost EVERY ONE OF US an illegal alien. [View all] Scrivener7 Jan 21 OP

I believe it applies to those here unlawfully osteopath6 Jan 21 #1

Back in the day, who came over "lawfully." Scrivener7 Jan 21 #4

ex post facto. NutmegYankee Jan 21 #15

Who says? Scrivener7 Jan 21 #17

You literally have objective quality evidence if you have a birth certificate NutmegYankee Jan 21 #22

My point is that settled law means nothing anymore. Scrivener7 Jan 22 #44

It seems the rules are "sort of" applying osteopath6 Jan 23 #48

The kind of "sort of" that results in women dying and families being tormented and separated. Scrivener7 Jan 23 #49

I hear you osteopath6 Jan 26 #50

I'm not saying they are correct osteopath6 Jan 21 #40

Most of our ancestors were here "unlawfully" in the sense Ocelot II Jan 21 #7

Yeah, mine came 1910-1925 LeftInTX Jan 21 #20

I have a photocopy of one Retrograde Jan 21 #23

A lot of our ancestors came over "unlawfully." yardwork Jan 21 #8

+1 exactly Emile Jan 21 #37

It's also intended to apply to people here lawfully, on temporary visas. Crunchy Frog Jan 21 #25

I forgot about them. LeftInTX Jan 21 #36

From the Executive Order in question arthurgoodwin Jan 21 #33

They will be able to deport anyone that they don't like. Blue Full Moon Jan 21 #2

Then Trump will be like durablend Jan 21 #3

For me, that would be liberalhistorian Jan 21 #16

This is ,....................... Well s***** it is not retroactive Srkdqltr Jan 21 #5

If they're going after people currently in the country, it is. Scrivener7 Jan 21 #6

Not that his idea isn't horrible and unconstitutional, it most assuredly is AZJonnie Jan 21 #9

How can Trump end something that is in the Constitution? gab13by13 Jan 21 #11

See my post #24 below where I explain what I think he's actually up to AZJonnie Jan 21 #26

He can if the Supreme Court rubber stamps it. Mariana Jan 22 #42

I'm pretty sure qazplm135 Jan 21 #13

AFAIK, the rest of the family, sans the child, could always have been deported AZJonnie Jan 21 #24

I think he wants the kids gone qazplm135 Jan 21 #32

I'm not sure you're following what I'm trying to say, sorry if I'm being unclear. AZJonnie Jan 22 #41

He wants the kids to be made to leave qazplm135 Jan 22 #43

It really doesn't take much cleverness to reckon that the courts may not decide the matter instantly AZJonnie Jan 22 #47

The US Census from 1850 - 1950 Historic NY Jan 21 #10

More fascist political theater. J_William_Ryan Jan 21 #12

Not really at peace, we have been bombing places in the Middle East for Israel questionseverything Jan 21 #31

The felon should start with Melania and Elon sanduca Jan 21 #14

It doesn't apply to people who were born before the EO took place. LeftInTX Jan 21 #18

Who says it won't next week. Scrivener7 Jan 21 #19

It will likely apply to people born next week and people born today. I have to read the order again. LeftInTX Jan 21 #21

It applies only to people born 30 days after the order was signed. LeftInTX Jan 21 #28

And who says that won't change next week? Scrivener7 Jan 21 #34

He would need to write another EO for it to change to another date. That is the specific wording from the order. LeftInTX Jan 21 #35

Right. So.... Scrivener7 Jan 21 #38

Okay but that's not the outcome they're working for, nor the one they will effect WhiskeyGrinder Jan 21 #27

I suspect your comment reflects a belief I am attempting to co-opt the disaster that's about to befall Scrivener7 Jan 22 #46

Don't worry, dRUMP. Conjuay Jan 21 #29

We are people without a country now. Irish_Dem Jan 21 #30

I wouldn't mind getting deported to the Netherlands. kerry-is-my-prez Jan 21 #39

I don't believe so. Such a thing did not exist before the Revolution, and it wasn't a thing until it suited the FF. mucholderthandirt Jan 22 #45

I've been saying this for some time proud patriot Jan 26 #51

My ancestors are in a 1650 census... RainCaster Jan 26 #52

cough dweller Jan 26 #53

Trump has already (in his first term) stripped some Texas Latinos of their passports DBoon Jan 26 #54

The OP's flawed reasoning onenote Jan 26 #55